Obesity Discussion Forums

[awb]

hi! i'm new here.
i don't know if this is the right place to write it,but maybe you can give me answers.
i used to be normal weight,but i always wanted to be thinner so i was always on diets,and....ended up gaining weight.i gained about 10 kg in a few years. i'm not overweight yet but still-i know that weight i gained is an outcome of my crazy yo-yo dieting.
anyways-i had a thought in my head-i wondered how many overweight people used to be thinner but gained weight just from struggling not to be overweight? is the fear of getting fat one of the causes of being overweight?
how many of you feel that you gained weight(even if you were overweight to begin with) just because the negative body image you had? is it widespread or is it only me?
i hope for replies...thanx

[Obesity Discussion]

Originally Posted by awb

hi! i'm new here.
i don't know if this is the right place to write it,but maybe you can give me answers.
i used to be normal weight,but i always wanted to be thinner so i was always on diets,and....ended up gaining weight.i gained about 10 kg in a few years. i'm not overweight yet but still-i know that weight i gained is an outcome of my crazy yo-yo dieting.
anyways-i had a thought in my head-i wondered how many overweight people used to be thinner but gained weight just from struggling not to be overweight? is the fear of getting fat one of the causes of being overweight?
how many of you feel that you gained weight(even if you were overweight to begin with) just because the negative body image you had? is it widespread or is it only me?
i hope for replies...thanx

Dieting just causes the dreaded yo-yo effect, because dieting is only meant to be a short-term solution. Lifestyle changes are what will keep the weight off long term.

Part of the problem with dieting is that many of them are crash diets with drastic reductions in calories, that can be borderline starvation. These types of diets can cause people to not only lose fat, but muscle as well, and muscle does burn some extra calories as well.

The fear of fat indirectly causes people to have this yo-yo effect or weight gain you speak of. It's the drastic measures they take in response to their fears that is directly the result of this.

Trust me when I say you are not alone.

[inlove]

Nope I worry about this too. Exercise and eat right....you should not gain. Good luck!!

[Irving]

Originally Posted by inlove

Nope I worry about this too. Exercise and eat right....you should not gain. Good luck!!

exactly just keep up for the long term and you will be good! no rush rush diets!

[inlove]

I am not one to talk though. I am probably the most impatient person around.

[Irving]

Originally Posted by inlove

I am not one to talk though. I am probably the most impatient person around.

[awb]

Originally Posted by Obesity Discussion

Dieting just causes the dreaded yo-yo effect, because dieting is only meant to be a short-term solution. Lifestyle changes are what will keep the weight off long term.

i atrted diets with intentions to maintain them.not fad diets,but eating in moderation,low fat,etc. the problem is it's so hard to change a life style.
the thing is- i wasn't even fat...i became fatter from trying to change my lifestyle,and eating healthier etc. but i just ended up bingeing and therefore i gained weight.i'm not nearly obese,but i feel that gaining that weight could've been avoided if i hadn't tried to lose weight on the first place.
i was never happy with my body,but i made it even worse by trying to eat less.i'm not skinny anymore,but close to being overweight.
now you can understand my negative approach towards dieting,or life style changing-call it what you want. maybe dieting is not for everyone? facts are that only a small percentage of people actually manage to maintain their weight. and what's with the rest of the people? are they going to just try and try only to find themselves failing again?and what's with the extra weight they gain,and the distress?
maybe dieting should be limited to people who really need it- for instance-if they have hyperlipidemia,a family history of heart attacks,diabetes etc. why are so many people i know on diets?

[Obesity Discussion]

Originally Posted by awb

i atrted diets with intentions to maintain them.not fad diets,but eating in moderation,low fat,etc. the problem is it's so hard to change a life style.
the thing is- i wasn't even fat...i became fatter from trying to change my lifestyle,and eating healthier etc. but i just ended up bingeing and therefore i gained weight.i'm not nearly obese,but i feel that gaining that weight could've been avoided if i hadn't tried to lose weight on the first place.
i was never happy with my body,but i made it even worse by trying to eat less.i'm not skinny anymore,but close to being overweight.
now you can understand my negative approach towards dieting,or life style changing-call it what you want. maybe dieting is not for everyone? facts are that only a small percentage of people actually manage to maintain their weight. and what's with the rest of the people? are they going to just try and try only to find themselves failing again?and what's with the extra weight they gain,and the distress?
maybe dieting should be limited to people who really need it- for instance-if they have hyperlipidemia,a family history of heart attacks,diabetes etc. why are so many people i know on diets?

First off to clarify, here we refer to: Diet=short term weight loss plan Lifestyle change=long term weight loss and keep it off plan

So you weren't overweight to begin with but went on diets anyway? The problem with diets and lifestyle changes is that not everyone can change their eating habits overnight, and it appeared as if you may fit into that group. Some people need to take things one step at a time and ease into it, slowly reducing calories over time.

That being said, the reason people you know who are on diets is because they're trying to lose weight for a number of reasons. To look good physically, feel better about themselves mentally, for health reasons, to fit into clothes better, etc.

Anyone who is overweight should try to lose the weight, mostly importantly for health reasons. Even being a little overweight greatly increases the chances of having health problems later in life, whether it be increased likelihood of cardiovascular disease, cancer, joint/bone problems, etc. Family history should not determine whether or not you choose to lose your excess weight. By allowing yourself to stay heavy you are creating your own history for yourself.

Lastly, think of everyone you influence. If you eat unhealthy and are overweight yourself, the people around you will be more likely to be overweight as well, including your children, and in turn their children. Your lifestyle choices are going to affect others.

[awb]

Originally Posted by Obesity Discussion

First off to clarify, here we refer to: Diet=short term weight loss plan Lifestyle change=long term weight loss and keep it off plan

So you weren't overweight to begin with but went on diets anyway? The problem with diets and lifestyle changes is that not everyone can change their eating habits overnight, and it appeared as if you may fit into that group. Some people need to take things one step at a time and ease into it, slowly reducing calories over time.

That being said, the reason people you know who are on diets is because they're trying to lose weight for a number of reasons. To look good physically, feel better about themselves mentally, for health reasons, to fit into clothes better, etc.

Anyone who is overweight should try to lose the weight, mostly importantly for health reasons. Even being a little overweight greatly increases the chances of having health problems later in life, whether it be increased likelihood of cardiovascular disease, cancer, joint/bone problems, etc. Family history should not determine whether or not you choose to lose your excess weight. By allowing yourself to stay heavy you are creating your own history for yourself.

Lastly, think of everyone you influence. If you eat unhealthy and are overweight yourself, the people around you will be more likely to be overweight as well, including your children, and in turn their children. Your lifestyle choices are going to affect others.

but what's the point to try to lose weight if the success rate is so low?
i believe people should eat healthier-whole wheat,less chocolate,more exercise etc. but trying to lose weight is much more than that. it's restricting calories. some people have to eat 1200 a day to lose weight.if they eat more they won't lose weight.that is very hard to stick too.
and think about the negative outcomes of trying to lose weight- the weight gain(which might be more than the weight lost-is it worth it,in terms of public health?),the eating disorders(i know all about that),the depression.and how many people actally succeed?
i'll give you an example-if you have a drug for a certain disease that works only for 5% of the people,but for the others it just has negative outcomes,and may even worsen the symptoms-would you prescribe it as a doctor?it's better not to give them the drug than prescribing it,hoping that they are in the lucky 5%.
i think it's the same thing here. eating healthy is one thing,but trying to lose weight-is not worth it. i admire your success in your weight loss.but you know very well that most people gain that weight back after 5 years, and maybe weigh even more than before.
and another thing-ever since i decided to accept my body the way it is(i don't want to talk about what happened 'till then), i started dropping some of the weight i gained. when i don't intend to lose weight- i lose weight. when i try to lose weight- i just gain weight.
i'm very interested to know if the increase in obesity has anything to do with the fear of obesity? maybe fighting it just worsened it? look at the increase in low calorie foods,health foods, exercise courses,etc. and yet-the obesity is just increasing.why? is it only lifestyle? or does it also have to do with the pressure to lose weight?

[William Wallace]

Originally Posted by awb

but what's the point to try to lose weight if the success rate is so low?

Are you saying everyone should just quit trying to lose weight because it's not easy? That sounds like a quitters mentality to me, and I for one am not a quitter, no matter what the odds. If I can even help one person lose weight and keep it off, that makes it all worth it to me. How do did you determine that the "success rate" is low? If you look at people on this site who we've helped, the success rate is fairly good.

Originally Posted by awb

i believe people should eat healthier-whole wheat,less chocolate,more exercise etc. but trying to lose weight is much more than that. it's restricting calories. some people have to eat 1200 a day to lose weight.if they eat more they won't lose weight.that is very hard to stick too.

1200 calories is not some magic number. You may be getting ahead of yourself. Leaving exercise/activity level out of the equation, lets say Person A says they want to lose 2lbs a week. Their body normally burns 2200 calories a day, and in order to meet their weight loss goals, they need to eat 1200 calories a day, which will allow them to lose 2lbs a week. But they don't HAVE to eat that little to lose weight. They can choose to eat 1700 calories and only lose one pound a week. Again, it's important to custom taylor each weight loss plan for the individual. Secondly, if this same person who burns 2200 a day without exercise decides to go to the gym and now burns 400 calories a day at the gym on average, their body will now burn 2600 calories a day (2200+400) and they can now afford to eat 1600 calories a day and still lose 2lbs a week. Again, you can adjust your lifestyle to allow you to meet your weight loss and eating goals.

Once you lose the weight through calorie reduction and/or exercise, you can adjust your calorie level up to where you can maintain that weight. You only need to drop the calories low while trying to lose weight.

Originally Posted by awb

and think about the negative outcomes of trying to lose weight- the weight gain(which might be more than the weight lost-is it worth it,in terms of public health?),the eating disorders(i know all about that),the depression.and how many people actally succeed?

The positive outcomes of losing the weight far outweight the negative outcomes of gaining weight or staying at a constant obese weight. You should go read some of the scientific studies we have in our studies section that cover a lot of the negative impacts of obesity, which include a roughly 50% increased chance of getting cancer, increased likelihood of getting diabetes, increased likelihood of having heart attacks and strokes, increased likelihood of having joint/bone/ligament problems, increased chance of having sleep apnea, increased chance of surgery complications, increased work absenteeism, and the list goes on and on and on. That doesn't even touch the other negative aspects of being obese such as making it harder to find clothes to wear, being more uncomfortable during day to day activities, sweating more, not fitting well in chairs, getting stared at, getting teased, being stereotyped, having less energy, extra cost of eating more food, and the list goes on and on.

Originally Posted by awb

i'll give you an example-if you have a drug for a certain disease that works only for 5% of the people,but for the others it just has negative outcomes,and may even worsen the symptoms-would you prescribe it as a doctor?it's better not to give them the drug than prescribing it,hoping that they are in the lucky 5%.
i think it's the same thing here. eating healthy is one thing,but trying to lose weight-is not worth it. i admire your success in your weight loss.but you know very well that most people gain that weight back after 5 years, and maybe weigh even more than before.

This is a horrible example because the success rate for those who lose try to lose weight and keep it off is greater than 5%, and there is no way that EVERYONE who doesn't lose weight in turn gets worse outcomes than when they started. I'm sorry, but you act like those who don't succeed with weight loss are always worse off than when they started and that is not the case.

Originally Posted by awb

and another thing-ever since i decided to accept my body the way it is(i don't want to talk about what happened 'till then), i started dropping some of the weight i gained. when i don't intend to lose weight- i lose weight. when i try to lose weight- i just gain weight.
i'm very interested to know if the increase in obesity has anything to do with the fear of obesity? maybe fighting it just worsened it? look at the increase in low calorie foods,health foods, exercise courses,etc. and yet-the obesity is just increasing.why? is it only lifestyle? or does it also have to do with the pressure to lose weight?

One of the only ways I could see one's weight loss attempts making things worse is if they try to lose weight the wrong way.

This is the biggest problem with weight loss and I'm sure a lot of what you are seeing, is that people don't know how to lose weight the right way. They're taking diet pills like it's some magic pill, starvation type diets, liquid diets, etc. These are the people who think, oh I can eat more because I'm taking a pill now, or hit the yo-yo effect from starvation.



If anything, I think that this type of attitude is what got us here in the first place, the "weight loss is hard and not a guarantee so I won't try and I will just become complacent with being obese."

[Merle]

Originally Posted by awb

i atrted diets with intentions to maintain them.not fad diets,but eating in moderation,low fat,etc. the problem is it's so hard to change a life style.
the thing is- i wasn't even fat...i became fatter from trying to change my lifestyle,and eating healthier etc. but i just ended up bingeing and therefore i gained weight.i'm not nearly obese,but i feel that gaining that weight could've been avoided if i hadn't tried to lose weight on the first place.
i was never happy with my body,but i made it even worse by trying to eat less.i'm not skinny anymore,but close to being overweight.
now you can understand my negative approach towards dieting,or life style changing-call it what you want. maybe dieting is not for everyone? facts are that only a small percentage of people actually manage to maintain their weight. and what's with the rest of the people? are they going to just try and try only to find themselves failing again?and what's with the extra weight they gain,and the distress?
maybe dieting should be limited to people who really need it- for instance-if they have hyperlipidemia,a family history of heart attacks,diabetes etc. why are so many people i know on diets?

I'm a little confused, here, you tried dieting even though you weren't fat, and feel that the diets caused you to become fat?

[awb]

of course losing weight is great for people who lose it.it prevents lots of things:diabetes,atherosclerosis,and many other medical problems,and has alot of benefits for the long term(even though ome of there researches are biased,but i'm, not going to get into that). in certain cases people who have medical problems should definitely try to lose weight(i believe it should not be done alone,but with a medical adviser).
but i think it's wrong to say that everyone who is overweight should try to lose weight. there is a differance between BMI 25-30 ,than 30 and up. i've actually read an article that says that people in that range of BMI are healthier than the "normal weight" so it's not so black and white. besided- weight isn't everything.the distribution of the fat is what matters- the amount of visceral fat(abdominal weight gain,as opposed to fat in the thighs). people with BMI 30 that their cholesterol lever low,and there blood pressure is not even close to prehypertension,even healthier than me,why should they try to lose weight?
i disagree with your claim that everyone who is overweight should try to lose weight.
when you say success-what do you mean?because within a year 1/3- 2/3 gain all the weight back,and after 5 years- nearly 95% gain their weight back or even more than what they lost(aren't you familiar with the statistics? )-is it worth it?it's very individual.
what i'm suggesting,is that more research should be done about how to achieve that goal(maintenance!!!not losing-losing is much easier),before telling everyone with BMI above 25 to lose weight.there are some articles in the national weight control regitry's internet site.
if you read the article: "change in energy expenditure resulting from altered body weight"
by leibel et al. in the nejm,it explains why it's so hard to maintain the weight loss.
i claim that there's not enough research done about the negative outcome of weight loss(and one of the reaons is that alot of people make money from making people believe that the less they weigh the better-they have too much power).
to sum things up not everyone is the same,and it's a problem to tell everyone who's overweight to lose weight.you have to weigh the benefits against the negative outcomes for each individual person before you advise someone to lose weight.in order to determine who has a higher chance to succeed,more research has to be done.
the advice to the pulic should be to eat heathy food,do more exercise,but the focus shouldn't be on losing weight,because anyways 95% will gain most of it back,or even more-so they might as well just maintain their weight(and if someone really has to lose weight-it should be monitered by a physician-but that's a different issue).

[awb]

Originally Posted by Merle

I'm a little confused, here, you tried dieting even though you weren't fat, and feel that the diets caused you to become fat?

sadly- yes. you see-one of the problems is that there is so much pressure to lose weight and such a fear of obesity,that everyone feels like they have to lose weight,even thin people(i see it all the time).and that's what i want to change-i want the advice to lose weight to be limited to cases where weight loss is a real benefit,after you weigh the benefits against the negative outcomes,taking into consideration the low success rate in long term weight maintenance.
i weighed 55 kg.i was so obssessed with losing weight that i ended up weighing 45 kg.the dieting caused eating disorders,and the constant fighting caused weight loss subsequent weight gain untill i reached 70 kg!!!! after going through psychological changes,i finally adapted a healthy attitude towards my body and food,and started dropping some of it(without restricting calories,without more exercise than usual,and without thinking about food.)
you know what? my advice-if you really want to lose weight,and you're determined-if you believe in yourself -you'll succeed.i think one important thing that i learned about loing weight-is to stop thinking about losing weight.learn haw to eat when you're hungry and learn how to listen to you stomach when it's full. that's what it's all about.the more you think about weight you want to lose-the more you think about food-and then you end up eating more.
good luck!

[Steve]

Originally Posted by awb

but what's the point to try to lose weight if the success rate is so low?

It's so low b/c people use retarded tactics to shed the fat.

i believe people should eat healthier-whole wheat,less chocolate,more exercise etc. but trying to lose weight is much more than that. it's restricting calories. some people have to eat 1200 a day to lose weight.if they eat more they won't lose weight.that is very hard to stick too.

Only very small people need to eat that few calories to lose weight. Not big people. And generally the smaller you are, the less you eat anyhow.

and think about the negative outcomes of trying to lose weight- the weight gain(which might be more than the weight lost-is it worth it,in terms of public health?),the eating disorders(i know all about that),the depression.and how many people actally succeed?

Lumping all dieting into one group isn't wise.

Communities such as this that promote effective ways to permanently lose the weight will squash any half-assed dieting attempt the you'll find your average person following.

Not all methods of fat loss lead to weight gain, EDs, and psychological pitfalls. Assuming otherwise is ludicrous.

i'll give you an example-if you have a drug for a certain disease that works only for 5% of the people,but for the others it just has negative outcomes,and may even worsen the symptoms-would you prescribe it as a doctor?it's better not to give them the drug than prescribing it,hoping that they are in the lucky 5%.

I don't get it.

So you are saying losing fat is always bad. Or 95% of the time. Do you understand how the body works?

i think it's the same thing here. eating healthy is one thing,but trying to lose weight-is not worth it. i admire your success in your weight loss.but you know very well that most people gain that weight back after 5 years, and maybe weigh even more than before.

Right, again, they used retarded tactics.

and another thing-ever since i decided to accept my body the way it is(i don't want to talk about what happened 'till then), i started dropping some of the weight i gained. when i don't intend to lose weight- i lose weight. when i try to lose weight- i just gain weight.

Taking your mind and n=1 out of the equations....

thermodynamics rules at the end of the day regardless. You didn't lose weight magically b/c you started thinking differently. You lost weight b/c of the thermodynamics involved in your situation.

i'm very interested to know if the increase in obesity has anything to do with the fear of obesity? maybe fighting it just worsened it? look at the increase in low calorie foods,health foods, exercise courses,etc. and yet-the obesity is just increasing.why? is it only lifestyle? or does it also have to do with the pressure to lose weight?

No.

Not IMO.

Certainly there were a lot of retarded dieting tactics floating around that most likely hurt more people than they helped.

That said though, our society is becoming more and more obese mainly due to the fact that our environment has drastically changed in a relatively short period of time leaving little/no time for evolution to run it's course. We are designed to store fat, not burn it. We are designed to over-consume, not under. We are designed to be active, not sedentary.

Yet, our environment today directly opposes these natural tendencies/inclinations.

And that's why we are fat.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by awb

of course losing weight is great for people who lose it.it prevents lots of things:diabetes,atherosclerosis,and many other medical problems,and has alot of benefits for the long term(even though ome of there researches are biased,but i'm, not going to get into that). certain cases people who have medical problems should definitely try to lose weight(i believe it should not be done alone,but with a medical adviser).

Hahahaha.

Do you know how much most MDs know about losing weight?

Doctors and even nutritionists are NOT the answer for weight loss. Individuals educated in nutrition AND exercise are the answer. The problem is, there aren't a lot of them around.

but i think it's wrong to say that everyone who is overweight should try to lose weight. there is a differance between BMI 25-30 ,than 30 and up.

You do realize that most people who are 25-30 BMI now have a good chance of being 30+ later?

Just sitting back and letting nature play its course is stupid IMO. That's what our population as a whole has done thus far and the outcome is the obesity epidemic. The epidemic is NOT caused by dieting as you seem to insinuate.

i've actually read an article that says that people in that range of BMI are healthier than the "normal weight" so it's not so black and white.

I'm pretty sure everyone here realizes that fat is not the only determinant of health.

besided- weight isn't everything.the distribution of the fat is what matters- the amount of visceral fat(abdominal weight gain,as opposed to fat in the thighs). people with BMI 30 that their cholesterol lever low,and there blood pressure is not even close to prehypertension,even healthier than me,why should they try to lose weight?

Better question.

Why shouldn't they?

I know plenty of bottom-heavy females that come to be to lose the fat b/c it gets in the way. Clothes don't fit them right. Their thighs rub. They have trouble with particular mobility issues. They want to look better.

It's not JUST about health. It's about quality of life too.

i disagree with your claim that everyone who is overweight should try to lose weight.
when you say success-what do you mean?because within a year 1/3- 2/3 gain all the weight back,and after 5 years- nearly 95% gain their weight back or even more than what they lost(aren't you familiar with the statistics? )

You are riding the numbers wayyyyyy to hard my friend. You are thinking very shallow. The numbers don't paint an accurate picture, as I said before.

what i'm suggesting,is that more research should be done about how to achieve that goal(maintenance!!!not losing-losing is much easier),before telling everyone with BMI above 25 to lose weight.there are some articles in the national weight control regitry's internet site.
if you read the article: "change in energy expenditure resulting from altered body weight"
by leibel et al. in the nejm,it explains why it's so hard to maintain the weight loss.

Yea, and?

So it would be better to simply be fat for the rest of your life? Your rational seems completely twisted.

And our bodies have natural setpoints; weights that we naturally want to set at. And being overweight is not it's natural state. This setpoint has nothing to do with food and activity and everything to do with the brain.

i claim that there's not enough research done about the negative outcome of weight loss(and one of the reaons is that alot of people make money from making people believe that the less they weigh the better-they have too much power).

I've helped 100+ people lose the weight and keep it off.

From my perspective, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

to sum things up not everyone is the same,and it's a problem to tell everyone who's overweight to lose weight.you have to weigh the benefits against the negative outcomes for each individual person before you advise someone to lose weight.

What are the negatives associated with fat loss? Please enlighten me. And since you are going around preaching your intelligence and research capabilities.... use big words. I promise, I'll understand.

in order to determine who has a higher chance to succeed,more research has to be done.

Ok.

Well while you're sitting there waiting for the research, I'm going to live in the real world where I help people obtain permanent fat loss through lifestyle modification.

the advice to the pulic should be to eat heathy food,do more exercise,but the focus shouldn't be on losing weight,because anyways 95% will gain most of it back,or even more-so they might as well just maintain their weight(and if someone really has to lose weight-it should be monitered by a physician-but that's a different issue).

Haha, you love that stat. Comical actually.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by awb

sadly- yes. you see-one of the problems is that there is so much pressure to lose weight and such a fear of obesity,that everyone feels like they have to lose weight,even thin people(i see it all the time).

If by this you mean people want to look good, feel vibrant, and have functional strength, I'm with ya.

Fact is though, that is not what you mean. And again you prove your ignorance on the subject.

and that's what i want to change-i want the advice to lose weight to be limited to cases where weight loss is a real benefit,after you weigh the benefits against the negative outcomes,taking into consideration the low success rate in long term weight maintenance.

Again, what are the negatives.

And you limit your thought process so much. I feel bad for you. I'll repeat myself one last time:

Losing weight is not all about health. Certainly a big part of it, but there's more to it.

i weighed 55 kg.i was so obssessed with losing weight that i ended up weighing 45 kg.the dieting caused eating disorders,and the constant fighting caused weight loss subsequent weight gain untill i reached 70 kg!!!!

So your inability to think logically and act rationally left you with the impression that fat loss = bad?

My advice, stop preaching from your extremist point of view.

after going through psychological changes,i finally adapted a healthy attitude towards my body and food,and started dropping some of it(without restricting calories,without more exercise than usual,and without thinking about food.)
you know what? my advice-if you really want to lose weight,and you're determined-if you believe in yourself -you'll succeed.i think one important thing that i learned about loing weight-is to stop thinking about losing weight.learn haw to eat when you're hungry and learn how to listen to you stomach when it's full. that's what it's all about.

I just love how you n=1 population size is enough for you to feel the need to preach to the masses.

Again, you should hop off the soapbox and step on a stage of comedy.

the more you think about weight you want to lose-the more you think about food-and then you end up eating more.
good luck!

Right.

[Obesity Discussion]

Originally Posted by Steve

From my perspective, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Boy I missed you Steve!